G73SW DDR3-1600MHz

[CrayOneFix]

I will share my mistake with all of you.
Maybe it will help someone else not to do the same error as me.

I ordered an Asus G73SW-A1 (I am very happy with, really quiet :))

On the configure page,
In the processor list we can read this (extract) :
i7-2630QM - Standard (Does not support DDR3 1600MHz Ram)
i7-2720QM

At this stage, we can think that the second one supports DDR3 1600MHz
In the point of view of the CPU, it is true.

In the RAM list we can read this (extract) :
8,192MB (8GB) DDR3 1333MHz Dual Channel Memory (4x2GB) - Standard
8,192MB (8GB) DDR3 1600MHz CL9 Kingston Hyper-X Dual Channel Memory (2x4GB) [Please Review Laptop Specs for Supported Memory Speeds]

My mistake was to think that if I choose i7-2720QM
I could choose the DDR3 1600MHz because this CPU is compatible with this frequency.

Yes but no !

I forgot about the motherboard.
Note: There is no mention of it in the configure window.:mad:

You can upgrade the processor, but the motherboard stays the same.
In my case it is an Intel chipset HM65 (memory speed 1333MHz)
and not an Intel HM67 (memory speed 1600MHz).

DO NOT buy a RAM DDR3 1600MHz with an Asus G73SW
even if you upgrade the CPU,
because the motherboard is not compatible with it.

If you want to know what you have, use HWiNFO32 tool.
If you have a RAM module type like :
PC3-12800 DDR3 SDRAM SO-DIMM
and a timing clock of ~666MHz instead of 800MHz
you have the response : your motherboard limit the frequency.

Yes I know, I only lose a few FPS while playing games,
but I also lose a few bucks too for nothing.

Thanks

[SmogHog]

I will share my mistake with all of you.
Maybe it will help someone else not to do the same error as me.

I ordered an Asus G73SW-A1 (I am very happy with, really quiet :))

On the configure page,
In the processor list we can read this (extract) :
i7-2630QM - Standard (Does not support DDR3 1600MHz Ram)
i7-2720QM

At this stage, we can think that the second one supports DDR3 1600MHz
In the point of view of the CPU, it is true.

In the RAM list we can read this (extract) :
8,192MB (8GB) DDR3 1333MHz Dual Channel Memory (4x2GB) - Standard
8,192MB (8GB) DDR3 1600MHz CL9 Kingston Hyper-X Dual Channel Memory (2x4GB) [Please Review Laptop Specs for Supported Memory Speeds]

My mistake was to think that if I choose i7-2720QM
I could choose the DDR3 1600MHz because this CPU is compatible with this frequency.

Yes but no !

I forgot about the motherboard.
Note: There is no mention of it in the configure window.:mad:

You can upgrade the processor, but the motherboard stays the same.
In my case it is an Intel chipset HM65 (memory speed 1333MHz)
and not an Intel HM67 (memory speed 1600MHz).

DO NOT buy a RAM DDR3 1600MHz with an Asus G73SW
even if you upgrade the CPU,
because the motherboard is not compatible with it.

If you want to know what you have, use HWiNFO32 tool.
If you have a RAM module type like :
PC3-12800 DDR3 SDRAM SO-DIMM
and a timing clock of ~666MHz instead of 800MHz
you have the response : your motherboard limit the frequency.

Yes I know, I only lose a few FPS while playing games,
but I also lose a few bucks too for nothing.

Thanks

Did you check your bios for XMP profile, which can be activated on notebooks that support XMP to overclock memory modules.

[powerpack]

Good write up. So currently we have no mobile platforms that will run JEDEC PC3-12800?

[Skarn]

Good write up. So currently we have no mobile platforms that will run JEDEC PC3-12800?
According to the manual as downloaded from Clevo, the 8170 can take 1600 MHz at 2x 2 GB. It does not state on the specifications page which sockets they need to be used in, but I suspect its the sockets under the keyboard.

[powerpack]

Good to know.

[Maverick494]

"Final Verdict

So there we have it: the Core i7's triple-channel memory controller shows little benefit over dual-channel but it doesn’t do any actual harm. Running astronomical memory speeds on Core i7 is a bit of a lost cause, and we recommend you stick to a maximum speed of 1333MHz, although the default 1066MHz speed works very nicely too. 12GB of memory works well but you’ll need a 64-bit operating system, and that's the real conclusion that we are taking away from all these days of testing. Don’t build a new Core i7 PC and run 32-bit software, but instead make the jump to 64-bit and pack it full of Ram. ®"

http://www.reghardware.com/2009/07/01/review_memory_for_intel_core_i7_cpu/page7.html

Now I will grant that this is with a desktop i7 first gen and not the second gen, but I cannot see how it would have changed that much. All this hoopla over 1600 MHZ memory is rather pointless. It does virtually nothing at all.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-870-1156,2482-9.html

look very closely at that graph, even the top of the top cas 8 DDR3 1600 is only a 5.1% gain over DDR2 800 on an LGA 1156. DDR3 1333 is 3.7%. Anyone think that applies universally? yea didn't think so, it doesn't. That is the max gain you will see and it is barely more than the DDR3 1333 which is not even the same CAS.

The next step forward I predict is going to be quad channel RAM instead of tons of speed increases!

[powerpack]

I like your post and comments very much on this. But your final comment on quad channel if serious and not sarcasm throws me. I think the fundamental issue is memory is so fast other components are now becoming the bottleneck? If so quad would mean nothing.

[Skarn]

http://www.reghardware.com/2009/07/01/review_memory_for_intel_core_i7_cpu/page7.html


http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i7-870-1156,2482-9.html

The next step forward I predict is going to be quad channel RAM instead of tons of speed increases!

Wow! Thanks for those links! Guess my search engine skills are a little bit rusty. :-/


{Referring to the Maverick494 post quoted above}

I like your post and comments very much on this. But your final comment on quad channel if serious and not sarcasm throws me. I think the fundamental issue is memory is so fast other components are now becoming the bottleneck? If so quad would mean nothing.

Memory manufacturers build memory with faster internal clock speeds or deeper interleaving, pushing motherboard and CPU manufacturers to build systems with faster FSBs so they can point fingers at each other saying ''I'm not your performance bottleneck, they are.''

Video card manufacturers create faster high-end video cards until they can saturate the bandwidth of the current bus, be it ISA, EISA, VLB, PCI, AGP, or PCI-E. To keep up, motherboard manufacturers create new versions of the local bus and/or FSB with more bandwidth for the video cards (or HDDs, SSDs, NICs, etc.) to try and saturate.

Viscous circle.

[powerpack]

Viscous circle.You are correct. But I do get it. 192bit on a GPU is tri-channel 256 is quad channel. I still currently think the hardware is above the software demands on system memory. I understand dual (tri/quad) theoritical bandwidths. My G73 is the first that actually surpassed the RAM bandwidth and made advantage of dual channel. Like 15GB/s.;)

Chipset matters a lot and I like mine.:)

[Skarn]

You are correct. But I do get it.
Sorry. Guess I just got a bit talkative there. :-/ Got all wrapped up in what I was learning last night and didn't pay enough attention to the conversation. :)

192bit on a GPU is tri-channel 256 is quad channel. I still currently think the hardware is above the software demands on system memory. I understand dual (tri/quad) theoritical bandwidths. My G73 is the first that actually surpassed the RAM bandwidth and made advantage of dual channel. Like 15GB/s.;)

Chipset matters a lot and I like mine.:)

IIRC, with the SIMMs in use in the 90s, dual channel would be useful (and was often used) even if the theoretical limit of the bandwidth was such that interleaving wouldn't be (theoretically) needed because the memory further out on the chip (such as the data beyond 400 MB on a 512 MB stick) might take a few extra clock cycles to be accessed than the memory 'closer' to the front electrically.

If this is still the case with modern DIMMs, expanding to triple- and quad-channel would still be useful to maximize performance.

[powerpack]

You seem to have some real world knowledge that is older than my real world knowledge. But the way I understand RAM and even now SSD's. The reason they are so wonderful is physical location of DATA has no penalty. To access it is more of a Matrix vs linear like a HDD for a lack of better explanation at this time. Further, now vs back in the day and RAM speeds? The speed of light has not changed.

Data location and retrivel has nothing to do with clocks. Never has never will.

I could tell you more about dual channel and the concept or you could just read my dual channel RAM guide sticky at NBR. You can go to the hardware section or just Google. It is old but the concept has not changed.

[jakeythesnake]

Back on topic for a sec, may I point out that it IS worth paying for the 1600MHz RAM for multiple reasons:

a) It comes in a 2x4GB configuration, allowing you to upgrade to the max 16GB without buying 4 complete new sticks of RAM (and thus is probably cheaper if you're going to do that).

b) You can use them in your next laptop...

c) If you run 1600MHz KHX at 1333MHz, seeing as it has "programmable CAS latency" won't it be CL7? 1600MHz CL9, 1333MHz CL7? Or is that not how it works...

But regardless, my first two points are valid.

[Maverick494]

Back on topic for a sec, may I point out that it IS worth paying for the 1600MHz RAM for multiple reasons:

a) It comes in a 2x4GB configuration, allowing you to upgrade to the max 16GB without buying 4 complete new sticks of RAM (and thus is probably cheaper if you're going to do that).

b) You can use them in your next laptop...

c) If you run 1600MHz KHX at 1333MHz, seeing as it has "programmable CAS latency" won't it be CL7? 1600MHz CL9, 1333MHz CL7? Or is that not how it works...

But regardless, my first two points are valid.

It would be able to run at CL7 very likely, but that would have to be set manually in the bios and I don't think the bios has the settings for that available on most laptops.

[powerpack]

Back on topic for a sec, may I point out that it IS worth paying for the 1600MHz RAM for multiple reasons:

a) It comes in a 2x4GB configuration, allowing you to upgrade to the max 16GB without buying 4 complete new sticks of RAM (and thus is probably cheaper if you're going to do that).

b) You can use them in your next laptop...

c) If you run 1600MHz KHX at 1333MHz, seeing as it has "programmable CAS latency" won't it be CL7? 1600MHz CL9, 1333MHz CL7? Or is that not how it works...

But regardless, my first two points are valid.No and what?