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xskatelifexmusic
10-20-2008, 06:39 PM
Alright so here's the deal. I have a $1500 dollar budget (really about 1450, but up to 1500 with shipping I guess)

Tell me if there is a better deal on something, anything bad (and good) about Sagers, how long laptops usually take from the time you order to the time you get...etc. :] thanks!!

I'm thinking a Sager NP 2096 http://www.sagernotebook.com/product_customed.php?pid=91133&action=customize

specs are:
- Display: 15.4" WSXGA+ LCD with Super Glossy Surface (1680X1050)[+$65.00]
- Processor: 45nm Intel® Core™ 2 Duo Processor P9500 / 6MB L2 Cache, 2.53GHz, 1066MHz FSB[+$120.00]
- Video & Graphics Card: Nvidia GeForce 9600M GT Graphics with 512MB DDR2 Video Memory
- Operating System: Genuine MS Windows® VISTA Home Premium 32/64-Bit Edition
- Memory: 4GB Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM at 800MHz - 2 X 2048MB
- Primary Hard Disk Drive: 320GB 7200rpm SATA 300 Hard Drive
- Optical Drive: 8X DVD±R/RW/4X +DL Super-Multi Drive & Software
- Wireless Network Card: Intel Wi-Fi Link 5100AGN - 802.11A/B/G/N Wireless LAN Module
- Bluetooth: Internal Bluetooth V2.0 + EDR Module
- Intel Robson Technology: Intel 4GB TurboMemory Module[+$85.00]
- Primary Battery: Smart Li-ION Battery Pack (9 Cells)
- Integrated Security Device: Fingerprint Reader
- Microsoft Office: Microsoft Office Ready with Free 60-Day Trial
- Warranty: Sager 1 Year Limited Parts and Labor Warranty with Three-Day Shipping Both Ways Paid

Jrock15
10-20-2008, 11:13 PM
Sagers are great laptops, I think they take a week to make then whatever shipping service you pay for will tell you how long till you get it after that.

Are you going to be gaming? Is this for school?

Tell us more about what you would like out of a laptop! =D

http://www.xoticpcforums.com/showthread.php?t=702 :D

Anewbus
10-21-2008, 10:53 AM
Just based on your budget as that is all you provided here so far I went ahead with some config ideas for you.
In looking at the configuration idea you listed I noticed a couple of things I would change in my opinion to save you some money and at the same time give you more bang for your buck.:)
First, I would drop the CPU down to the 2.4GHz. You won’t notice any difference between the 2.53GHz and the 2.4GHZ. The reason I would drop down a notch is so you can use the money towards a better warranty.
Since I mentioned it, I would definitely upgrade the warranty to the 3 year Parts & Labor. It will give you more peace of mind because for one thing a warranty like that tells you that the laptop will last at least that long with proper care, although with that said, it will last well beyond that, try 4 years, 5 years or more. Yes, it does include the 24/7 toll free support, and the Three Day shipping both ways should service be needed. Next, I would drop the Intel Robinson Turbo memory. It’s a waste of money, you don’t need it unless your running CAD programs or heavy video and audio editing or any heavy duty rendering intensive stuff.
I would also drop the Microsoft Office as you may be able to pick that up later for a better price, unless you must have it right now.

Here’s a config I came up with for the NP2096:

Sager NP2096 Custom Laptop (Built on the Compal JHL90) (http://www.xoticpc.com/product_info.php?products_id=2409%7B76%7D647%7B187 %7D1757%7B94%7D1074%7B92%7D2422%7B88%7D2410%7B186% 7D734%7B93%7D2044%7B193%7D657%7B112%7D656%7B98%7D1 295%7B96%7D2434%7B168%7D1453%7B116%7D1416%7B117%7D 890%7B120%7D703%7B110%7D2486%7B169%7D1449%7B119%7D 1898%7B100%7D734%7B164%7D1441%7B107%7D1539%7B106%7 D1688%7B121%20)
- 15.4" WSXGA+ "Glare Type" Super Clear Ultra Bright Glossy Screen (1680x1050)
- Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound
- Standard Dead Pixel Policy
- ~Intel® P8600 45nm "Montevina" Core™2 Duo 2.40GHz w/3MB L2 On-die cache - 1066MHz FSB 25 watt
- 512MB PCI-Express nVidia GeForce 9600M GT DDR2 DX10
- ~ 4,096MB DDR2 800 (2 SODIMMS) Dual Channel Memory (Requires Vista 64-Bit to recognize Full 4GB)
- Standard Finish
- ~Combo 8x8x6x4x Dual Layer DVD +/-R/RW 5x DVD-RAM 24x CD-R/RW Drive w/Softwares
- ~ 320GB 7200RPM (Serial-ATA II 300 - 16MB Cache)
- Internal 3-in-1 Card Reader (SD/MMC/MS)
- Internal Bluetooth 2.0+ EDR
- Built-in Intel® PRO/Wireless 5100 802.11 a/g/n
- Built in 2.0 Megapixel Camera
- Sound Blaster Compatible 3D Audio - Included
- Carying Case Optional (Select if desired)
- Smart Li-ion Battery (9-Cell)
- Integrated Fingerprint Reader
- ~Windows Vista Home Premium 64-Bit Installed (64&32-Bit CD Included) w/ Drivers & Utilities CD's
- Sager 3 Year Parts & Labor Warranty, Lifetime Sager Toll Free Support

TOTAL = $1360.91 with cash discount (shipping and tax not included)

As you can see this leaves enough money for other things like perhaps if you wanted a custom skin job on your lappy or aftermarket items such as software or whatever. Oh, as for the tax, don’t worry too much, depending on where you live and how you want it shipped you may be able to avoid having to pay sales tax.

Here’s another machine you might want to look at. It’s actually the same machine as the Sager 2096, but the customizations offered are a little different.
You’ll see on this one that the HD is 5400RPM as opposed to 7200RPM. However, due to the size and design of this HD the 5400RPM is not much of a downgrade at all. Like the 7200rpm, it has good file access times (important in gaming), but runs a bit cooler and uses less battery power. This is due partly to the more efficient design in drives this size and larger.
Also, this machine has the 3 year warranty as standard.
I also opted to go with the 32-bit version of Vista as it is more stable than the 64-bit version at this time. (The 32-bit version gets along better with drivers than the 64 bit version does).

FORCE 3310 (Built on COMPAL JHL90) (http://www.xoticpc.com/product_info.php?products_id=2455%7B76%7D650%7B187 %7D1757%7B94%7D1074%7B92%7D2446%7B88%7D2410%7B186% 7D734%7B93%7D2489%7B193%7D657%7B112%7D656%7B98%7D1 799%7B96%7D2349%7B168%7D1453%7B116%7D1416%7B117%7D 890%7B120%7D702%7B110%7D2486%7B169%7D1449%7B119%7D 1898%7B100%7D734%7B164%7D1441%7B107%7D1539%7B106%7 D1688%7B121%20)
- 15.4" WSXGA+ "Glare Type" Super Clear Ultra Bright Glossy Screen (1680x1050) `
- Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound
- Standard Dead Pixel Policy
- -Intel® P8600 45nm "Montevina" Core™2 Duo 2.40GHz w/3MB L2 On-die cache - 1066MHz FSB 25 watt
- 512MB PCI-Express nVidia GeForce 9600M GT DDR2 DX10
- - 4,096MB DDR2 800MHz KINGSTON HyperX Matched Kit - Low Latency CL5 (2 SODIMMs) Dual Channel Memory SPECIAL!
- Standard Finish-
- Combo Dual Layer SuperMulti 8X DVDRW Drive w/ Software
- - 320GB 3GB/S SATA II 5400RPM Hard Drive
- Internal 3-in-1 Card Reader (SD/MMC/MS)
- Built-in Intel® PRO/Wireless 5100 802.11 a/g/n
- Built in 2.0 Megapixel Camera
- Sound Blaster Compatible 3D Audio - Included
- Carying Case Optional (Select if desired)
- Smart Li-ion Battery (9-Cell)
- Integrated Fingerprint Reader
- -Windows Vista Home Premium 32-Bit w/ Drivers & Utilities CD's
- 3 Year Complete Care Full Parts / Labor Warranty - Next Business Day Shipping both ways - Lifetime 24/7 DOMESTIC Tech Support

TOTAL = $1456.94 with cash discount (shipping and tax not included)

This cost a bit more as you can see, but it has slightly faster memory and again the warranty is included. (You could consider running XP instead of Vista, which would save a few bucks).
Either machine will serve you well as they are the same, just configured different with slightly different memory basically.

xskatelifexmusic
10-21-2008, 04:52 PM
thanks for all the help! I'll follow what you said about the Sager website one I think, and I appreciate the linking of an alternate computer. I'm buying it strictly for gaming (have a school lappy..has horrible specs for gaming) but I can't spend more than 1500..thanks again for the guideline on reducing the price of the sager! :]

xskatelifexmusic
10-21-2008, 04:56 PM
oo didnt know there was a thread for this already...but can you please tell me whether I should get XP or 32-bit Vista? and how do I choose between 32/64? There wasn't an option on the sager website, just told me that it was 32/64

Anewbus
10-21-2008, 05:24 PM
Ah, I see. All the configs I did above are from XoticPC's website. If I were you, I would purchase from here for the following reasons:
1) Fantastic customer service!:notworthy
2) You may be able to avoid having to pay sales tax
3) XoticPC packs for shipping appropiately
4) XoticPC stands behind the machines they sell
5)Very competitive pricing
6) You get a copy of the OS you choose on an official disc as well as another separate disc for the drivers (No hidden back up of the OS someplace on the HD taking up even more room like other retailers give you instead of an official disc)
7) NO BLOATWARE
8) The best warranties in the industry

Ok, as to the "Gee, how do I avoid the sales tax"? If you live in a state like CA that charges sales tax the way to avoid that is to place your order with XoticPC and have the lappy shipped to XoticPC first and then XoticPC will ship to you. (The Sagers are built in CA and if you have your lappy shipped direct from the builder, you will be charged tax).
It will take just a few extra days, but it is well worth it:
1) You save a ton of money in tax (an additional savings of about $100 or more on a $1300 price tag by the way).
2) It gives a chance for XoticPC to run their rigorous testing on it to be double sure it will be perfect when you get it.

As to the OS you get, it's really a personal preference. If your used to XP then you may want to stick with that. It does take up less room than Vista and it is a bit cleaner. Or you could go with Vista as I hear it does very well in gaming. (Vista kind of makes its own Virtual Machine when you load up a game which is a good thing).
As I mentioned before the 32-bit version tends to be more driver friendly then the 64-bit version.
On the Sager 2096 you actually get both versions of Vista and on an official disc! That's why it says 32/64. I imagine you can specify when you order that you would like the 32 bit version loaded. (Don't worry, you will still get both on official disc).

xskatelifexmusic
10-21-2008, 06:47 PM
okay cool, thanks. one last question though-- if you had the Force/Sager laptop that you recommended, would you get XP or Vista?

P.S.

also, Sager or Force? I mean, looking at both of those builds, would you buy a Sager or a Force?

PSRT
10-21-2008, 08:57 PM
okay cool, thanks. one last question though-- if you had the Force/Sager laptop that you recommended, would you get XP or Vista?

P.S.

also, Sager or Force? I mean, looking at both of those builds, would you buy a Sager or a Force?

Seeing as RAM won't be a problem, it really comes down to preference. Have you used Vista before? Generally speaking, many performance and stability issues were resolved in service pack 1, however, XP will still outperform Vista in many cases when running legacy software.

If you're worried about gaming, however, I would personally recommend Vista. That is unless, of course, you were planning on busting out some old-school titles...

And the Sager/Force question...I'm biased here, having just ordered a Sager and having never really looked into the Force...I would go with the Sager, simply because of the overwhelmingly positive feedback it gets around these boards. Of course, Anewbus loves his Force...whichever gives you the greater bang for your buck, go with, since both will be great machines.

xskatelifexmusic
10-21-2008, 09:53 PM
alright thanks...I think I'm getting my force (1,430.75 with 2.4ghz, GeForce 9600m GT, 4gb of RAM, 320gb 3g/s 5400 rpm HDD)

but now it's down to the OS..I think I'm getting XP, not sure..I'll be playing games based on half-life 1 (like cs 1.6, mostly) and source games...I've never used vista, so I'm still a bit confused.. I think half-life 1 based games should be the oldest ones I would be playing.. and i love counter-strike 1.6. So should I get XP, and then just wait until it becomes absolutely necessary, and get vista then?

EDIT: even though I'll be playing older games, I'm also for sure going to be playing newer ones like left 4 dead, tf2, counterstrike:source, halflife 2:death match, many source-based mods, Garry's mod, starcraft 2, possibly diablo 3, fallout 3, and I also really enjoy World of Warcraft.

Anewbus
10-22-2008, 10:56 AM
alright thanks...I think I'm getting my force (1,430.75 with 2.4ghz, GeForce 9600m GT, 4gb of RAM, 320gb 3g/s 5400 rpm HDD)

but now it's down to the OS..I think I'm getting XP, not sure..I'll be playing games based on half-life 1 (like cs 1.6, mostly) and source games...I've never used vista, so I'm still a bit confused.. I think half-life 1 based games should be the oldest ones I would be playing.. and i love counter-strike 1.6. So should I get XP, and then just wait until it becomes absolutely necessary, and get vista then?

EDIT: even though I'll be playing older games, I'm also for sure going to be playing newer ones like left 4 dead, tf2, counterstrike:source, halflife 2:death match, many source-based mods, Garry's mod, starcraft 2, possibly diablo 3, fallout 3, and I also really enjoy World of Warcraft.

Hmm, I'm an XP person myself, but that's only personal preference. I'm not sure about older games and Vista. If my thinking is correct, XP would be a safe choice as it should handle all but the most overly-demanding games out there. I would check with someone more in the know on that though because I could be somewhat off the mark on that. (I'm not an avid gamer so I'm not familar with details of all the games. I just mess about once in a while with some FPS or golf or Riven type stuff).

robamb2002
10-22-2008, 11:44 AM
FYI if you are getting 4 GB ram: XP and Vista32 will only register/utilize 3 GB of that. the only way to utilize all 4 GB is with a 64bit OS that may help in your decision... also if you are really nostalgic for the old school games and have a copy of XP laying around, you could always install VirtualPC and install xp on that, its emulated hardware runs all older games that vista won't support (mainly 16bit games)

I was an XP man myself until I got my sager and got used to vista.(things are moving away from XP... hell they are almost ready to move away from vista... welcome to the world of OS marketing. you get a system almost workable and release it. package it with everything you can and dicontinue support on the stable predicessor. release a service pack to stablize the system and start the process over :rolleyes:

Anewbus
10-22-2008, 12:04 PM
FYI if you are getting 4 GB ram: XP and Vista32 will only register/utilize 3 GB of that. the only way to utilize all 4 GB is with a 64bit OS that may help in your decision... also if you are really nostalgic for the old school games and have a copy of XP laying around, you could always install VirtualPC and install xp on that, its emulated hardware runs all older games that vista won't support (mainly 16bit games)

I was an XP man myself until I got my sager and got used to vista.(things are moving away from XP... hell they are almost ready to move away from vista... welcome to the world of OS marketing. you get a system almost workable and release it. package it with everything you can and dicontinue support on the stable predicessor. release a service pack to stablize the system and start the process over :rolleyes:

Thanks for bring that up Roamb, My bad, I forgot to mention the detail about the RAM being recognized. (All I ever hear is hype about Vista that it makes me think Vista uses all 4GB of ram no matter what. I keep forgetting the physical restrictions of 32 bit vs 64 bit).

Personally, I tried Vista for half a day and just can't stand it myself. Nothing is where it should be and none of my programs from MSOffice (XP) to games like MOH to my CD burning and audio programs will work with it. I would have to run out and repurchase everything and some of it is extremely expensive and I could not afford it now. That's what really turned me off, otherwise I would have given it a little more time and would have eventually gotten over the hurdle of finding where things are. So I'm personally sticking with XP even after it's put to pasture as they say.

That said though, if a person is starting fresh and has programs that will work fine in Vista, then Vista might be the way to go.
By the way, your absolutely right about the marketing.

xskatelifexmusic
10-22-2008, 12:29 PM
alright, well it looks like I'm gonna get XP, and just wait until it's honesty necessary to get Vista..I'm much more used to XP, and I know it much better.. I'll get 64-bit Vista in a year or so, once Vista is fully stable and all that.. I just feel so muc h more at home with XP :)
also, for ram, my choices were 2GB or 4GB so since I'll eventually upgrade to vista I'm getting 4gb

EDIT: wait, shouldnt I just slap linux on it and run that WINE thingy for all windows games?

Anewbus
10-22-2008, 12:41 PM
alright, well it looks like I'm gonna get XP, and just wait until it's honesty necessary to get Vista..I'm much more used to XP, and I know it much better.. I'll get 64-bit Vista in a year or so, once Vista is fully stable and all that.. I just feel so muc h more at home with XP :)
also, for ram, my choices were 2GB or 4GB so since I'll eventually upgrade to vista I'm getting 4gb

EDIT: wait, shouldnt I just slap linux on it and run that WINE thingy for all windows games?

In the world of computers, future-proofing is always a good idea, so I would go ahead and stick with the 4GB of RAM.

I know nothing about Linux other than the fact that I may end up migrating to that myself down the road as I hear it's very stable. I wonder how much RAM it can recognize though? Is that WINE the Windows emulator? If it is, you may have good idea there. I'm sure someone who knows all about this will come along shortly and straighten it out for us.:)

xskatelifexmusic
10-22-2008, 01:44 PM
haha yeah, So I'm hardware-future proofing for Vista, but I really just dont think I want Vista now, you know? XP is like my home field haha, and all games out right now can run on XP, correct? (the games that at the top say windows games and have a vista symbol, those can run on XP right?)

and hopefully someone comes along and explains the pro's and con's for Linux regarding gaming :D

EDIT: well, for better or worse, I just ordered it! XP SP2, 4GB RAM, 2.4ghz processor, 320gb 5400 rpm 3b/s HDD, 512mb GeForce 9600m GT, extra keyboard w/ backlight and gaming shortcuts, car adapter, total price is 1600 something. (mom helped pay! :D)

I cant friggin wait till I get this laptop man, I'm SO EXCITED!

Anewbus
10-22-2008, 02:06 PM
haha yeah, So I'm hardware-future proofing for Vista, but I really just dont think I want Vista now, you know? XP is like my home field haha, and all games out right now can run on XP, correct? (the games that at the top say windows games and have a vista symbol, those can run on XP right?)

and hopefully someone comes along and explains the pro's and con's for Linux regarding gaming :D

EDIT: well, for better or worse, I just ordered it! XP SP2, 4GB RAM, 2.4ghz processor, 320gb 5400 rpm 3b/s HDD, 512mb GeForce 9600m GT, extra keyboard w/ backlight and gaming shortcuts, car adapter, total price is 1600 something. (mom helped pay! :D)

I cant friggin wait till I get this laptop man, I'm SO EXCITED!

Hey congrats on your order!:smile2: (Remember to thank your mom).;)
Your going to love your lappy.
As far as Windows games with the Vista symbol being playable on XP. What you want to do is find the required specs on the box and read those to make sure it states that it will work on XP. Usually, you'll see that there is a list of compatible OSs (might say something like "compatible with Vista, XP, Win2000" etc.). If XP is listed then your good to go. If however, XP is not listed in the requirements on the box, then it is for Vista only.

PSRT
10-22-2008, 04:31 PM
The only Vista-only games right now are Halo 2, Shadowrun, and Frontlines (I think). I'm sure I'm missing a few, but in all honesty, there's no way in hell anyone would want to play these games on PC in the first place, so there's no reason to worry.

xskatelifexmusic
10-22-2008, 04:35 PM
heh yeah, I wrote my mom an e-mail thanking her profusely (I'm at my dads house 'else I'd do it in person)
and thank you all for helping me decide which laptop!! you've been extremely helpful and nice :)

Anewbus
10-22-2008, 05:21 PM
heh yeah, I wrote my mom an e-mail thanking her profusely (I'm at my dads house 'else I'd do it in person)
and thank you all for helping me decide which laptop!! you've been extremely helpful and nice :)

My pleasure, glad to have helped. :) Feel free to post here with any other questions or needs. By the way, if it is something really urgent, feel free to call XoticPC toll free. Justin and crew there at the shop are also extremely helpful and nice.

xskatelifexmusic
10-22-2008, 07:49 PM
awesome...I'm glad I ordered from here, I've only heard 1 bad thing out of the rest of everything I've ever read about xoticpc (the guy who wrote about xotic badly was just an idiot)
haha :)

I cant wait to play games like WoW on great settings with a great framerate hehe, I'm so tired of getting 6fps in alterac valley lmao

So they said it'd be 3-7 days to build, and 2 day shipping..I'll post when I get it for sure!

EDIT: will my laptop be upgradeable? I mean in the future, if I would want to upgrade the RAM, video card, or CPU, would I be able to?

robamb2002
10-23-2008, 07:01 AM
the memory, GPU and CPU are all "user upgradeable." basically you can do the upgrade yourself that is only slightly more complex than the desktop equivelant. the memory is as easy as poping it out and putting in a new stick, the GPU process is the same (though I've heard it is extremely hard to find an upgrade card aside from ebay) and the CPU is simallar to a desktop CPU swap. In all cases make sure that the system is capable of supporting the new hardware first.

Congrats on the new system :)

xskatelifexmusic
10-23-2008, 08:31 AM
the memory, GPU and CPU are all "user upgradeable." basically you can do the upgrade yourself that is only slightly more complex than the desktop equivelant. the memory is as easy as poping it out and putting in a new stick, the GPU process is the same (though I've heard it is extremely hard to find an upgrade card aside from ebay) and the CPU is simallar to a desktop CPU swap. In all cases make sure that the system is capable of supporting the new hardware first.

Congrats on the new system :)


thanks man..I'm so excited! if you could tell me what you think the fps I'd be getting on source-based games at max/high settings (TF2, Garry's mod, Counterstrike:source and Half life2:deathmatch) would be, that would be really really helpful...and with the 1680x1050 screen, everything should look SUPER nice, right?

Anewbus
10-23-2008, 09:45 AM
thanks man..I'm so excited! if you could tell me what you think the fps I'd be getting on source-based games at max/high settings (TF2, Garry's mod, Counterstrike:source and Half life2:deathmatch) would be, that would be really really helpful...and with the 1680x1050 screen, everything should look SUPER nice, right?

I don't know the exact frame rate in numbers you will get, but it should satisfy you. I'm sure someone here would know that though. Overall, things will look more than super nice! I have the same native resolution screen (1680x1050) and only 2GB RAM and a 512MB NVidia 8600 GT something GPU, 2.1GHz proc running XP and I get great framerate and overall graphics on MOH, COD & COD2, etc. That's running everything on nearly max! My lappy outperforms my desktop presently! So if I'm getting that, imagine what you will see.
By the way, just so you know, you may not be able to run everything on absolute max, but you will get close. You'll be able to put power where it counts in the game settings. Some games will let you nearly max out everything and others may be a bit more restrictive, but not enough to make it miserable. If you run into that situation what you can do is lower the unimportant or less important settings a notch so you can concentrate power to the important ones. Overall, you'll be amazed at what your lappy will do.
When I got mine I was told I should be able to run everything on medium settings just great. When I tested it by loading MOH and COD I was able to run everything at nearly max with no trouble. I was blown away because I was not expecting to be able to do that.

xskatelifexmusic
10-23-2008, 09:51 AM
I don't know the exact frame rate in numbers you will get, but it should satisfy you. I'm sure someone here would know that though. Overall, things will look more than super nice! I have the same native resolution screen (1680x1050) and only 2GB RAM and a 512MB NVidia 8600 GT something GPU, 2.1GHz proc running XP and I get great framerate and overall graphics on MOH, COD & COD2, etc. That's running everything on nearly max! My lappy outperforms my desktop presently! So if I'm getting that, imagine what you will see.
By the way, just so you know, you may not be able to run everything on absolute max, but you will get close. You'll be able to put power where it counts in the game settings. Some games will let you nearly max out everything and others may be a bit more restrictive, but not enough to make it miserable. If you run into that situation what you can do is lower the unimportant or less important settings a notch so you can concentrate power to the important ones. Overall, you'll be amazed at what your lappy will do.
When I got mine I was told I should be able to run everything on medium settings just great. When I tested it by loading MOH and COD I was able to run everything at nearly max with no trouble. I was blown away because I was not expecting to be able to do that.

heh sweet thanks for telling me that :D