Asus vs Sager vs Sager, I need YOUR guidance!

[Lost]

Hey guys,

I am having a lot of difficulties trying to pick out a laptop, i have
three choices at the bottom and posted this set of answers to help.
:notworthy


Hoping for <1,500 USD
13"-15"
In the USA, buying it from Xotic of couse.
For college and gaming, COD4, DemiGod, etc.
Need a solid build, hoping to last 4 years.
My main concerns are:
-Quality of warranty service, Sager vs Asus?
-Over heating and loud fans
-DDR2 vs DDR3?
-Feel of keyboard and track pad



---ASUS N81VP-C1 ~ 1350 USD---
14" HD 16:9 (1366x768) Glossy LED
1,024MB DDR3 ATI HD4650
Intel® Core 2 Duo T9550 2.66GHz 1066MHz FSB 6MB L2 Cache (Customizable)
4GB DDR2 800MHz
320GB 7200RPM
2 Year ASUS GLOBAL Warranty, 24/7 Support, 1 Year Accidental Coverage

---SAGER NP2098 ~1300 USD---
15.6" HD 16:9 WXGA
Intel® P9700 45nm "Montevina" Core™2 Duo 2.8GHz w/6MB L2 On-die cache - 1066MHz FSB 25 watt
ATI HD4650 512MB PCI-Express DDR3
4,096MB DDR3 1066MHz Dual Channel Memory
320GB 7200RPM
Sager 3 Year Parts & Labor Warranty, Lifetime Sager Toll Free Support

---Sager NP8662 ~1700 USD---
15.4" WSXGA+ "Glare Type
P9700 45nm "Montevina" Core™2 Duo 2.8GHz w/6MB L2 On-die cache - 1066MHz FSB 25 watt
nVidia GeForce GTX 260M 1,024MB PCI-Express DDR3 DX10
4,096MB DDR3 1066MHz Dual Channel Memory
320GB 7200RPM
3 Year Labor* 1 Year Parts Warranty Lifetime 24/7 DOMESTIC Based


I need the gurus of Xotic to guide me through it all :notworthy:notworthy:notworthy

Thank you in advance!!!
Any suggestions for other models would be appreciated!!!

-Lost

[Anewbus]

Hi Lost,

These machines will last 3 years with proper care easily. However, it’s not unheard of to go 4 or even 5 years.
The warranty services vary a little.
Asus = is fine if you are global. I only hear they tend to make you jump through some hoops, but nothing to worry about. I don’t have experience with them.
Sager = I hear they can be a bit of a headache at times, but ok.
XoticPC warranty = simply the best. They have your back.
That said though if you go with a Sager warranty and have trouble with them the fine folks at XoticPC will help you out by being a liaison or omnibudsman of sorts or something.

Of the three machines you are looking at the best one is obvious. That would be the NP8662. Second in your choices would be the Asus N81VP if you wanted a 14-inch.
However, that’s just based on GPU mostly. The native screen resolution on the Asus and NP2098 are a little funky.
If you want a 15.4 inch then the 8662 is the way to go.
I’m assuming you are not getting an OS with the machine as I guess you have your own you will be loading?
I have an idea:
If you’re not quite comfortable with the warranty the 8662 comes with you could do the following to get the Xotic 3 year full warranty. (The best).
1) If you drop your CPU to 2.66GHz and select the Xotic 3-year warranty ($259) the total price would be $1732.42
2) If you go with the 2.53GHz CPU that comes standard and get the Xotic 3 year warranty the total comes to $1679.07

The 2.53 and 2.66 CPUs are plenty powerful and you won’t be missing anything really unless your trying to play GTA4 or running some other program that requires a ridiculously powerful CPU. The difference between the 2.53 and 2.66 is not noticeable either to humans.
The real performance aspects come in a combo of CPU, GPU, RAM and HDD speed. The GPU on the 8662 is extremely powerful so it doesn’t need much help from the CPU. You already have it configed with enough RAM and a 7200rpm HDD, so you’re good to go.
The only thing is that even with the 2.53GHz CPU the 8662 is still $179 over your max budget.

[powerpack]

I am going:
NP8662-is the best
NP2098-is the best value
N81-smallest form factor

You make the choices hard. You picked 3 winners.

Asus is known for bad battery life. My Asus likes to drop keystrokes and have heard same for others. Not sure if that Asus has the same issues.

All you posted have advantages and it just depends on your wants. NP8662 is clearly the best but it is also the biggest.

[Lost]

Ah, I see. I was hoping that a few tenths in cpu wouldn't be a major problem.
Thank you so much Anewbus and Powerpack for the advice and the time!
By the quality of the forum participants i can see how excellent Xotic warranty must be.
I think i am leaning towards the 8662, might just dive right into it.

any one else have a piece or two to throw out here?
thanks again Anewbus and Powerpack.:notworthy

[DRY_ICE]

I've got the 8662 and I love it :-). DO IT.

[powerpack]

On your main issues (OP). I did address keyboard issue. Fans should be fine on all. Of course the NP8662 will run more. Sager vs Asus warranty? I say both are good and one benefit of buying from Xotic is they can facilitate.

DDR2 and DDR3 makes no difference at this point. The higher CL nix's the speed advantage.

[Anewbus]

Ah, I see. I was hoping that a few tenths in cpu wouldn't be a major problem.
Thank you so much Anewbus and Powerpack for the advice and the time!
By the quality of the forum participants i can see how excellent Xotic warranty must be.
I think i am leaning towards the 8662, might just dive right into it.

any one else have a piece or two to throw out here?
thanks again Anewbus and Powerpack.:notworthy

Your welcome, glad I could be of some help.:)

[robamb2002]

From my understanding, the DDR2 to DDR3 difference comes out to around 5% in benchmarks (saw this figure thrown around quite a few months back by one of the Justins) I think the real advantage of DDR3 will not be recognized unless you have a triple channel system like the core i7 machines. (sorry I don't have any references to back this statement up at the moment :()

I put my vote in for the NP8662. that beast rocks!

[Lost]

Thank you all so much!
The DDR2 vs DDR3 piece has calmed a bit of my nerves.
I was under the assumption that DDR3 would soon be the mainstream within a few months.
I think that right now i would try my hardest to get some kind of xoticpc warranty :)

A few more questions for all you gurus :p

is the 3mb cache difference in L2 great? In terms of performance?
and is the P8700 cpu part of the Centrino 2 combo? For that matter, is Centrino 2 Tech
that great? I thought i knew my way around computers, but i am starting to doubt my own
knowledge :s good thing you guys are here!!! :)

Thanks again for your time.

Any one else got a piece to add?
Or maybe another laptop to add to the list? :-/

[Woody]

From my understanding, the DDR2 to DDR3 difference comes out to around 5% in benchmarks (saw this figure thrown around quite a few months back by one of the Justins) I think the real advantage of DDR3 will not be recognized unless you have a triple channel system like the core i7 machines....

In some applications DDR3 can be slower than DDR2 due to the higher latencies. The performance difference is essentially negligible. The main advantage for DDR3 in notebooks is that it uses less power and is therefore more efficient.

Core i7 requires DDR3 and the triple channel does improve performance but that only applies of course to desktop Core i7 processors.

DDR3 prices have fallen drastically and are now almost in line with DDR2 so DDR3 should become mainstream pretty quickly now. Just because your laptop uses DDR2, however, it doesn't mean it will suffer in any way since DDR2 upgrades will be available for a long time to come.

In other words, DDR3 vs DDR2 does not have to be a consideration when choosing a laptop.

[potent]

Hi again,

This is a topic that I can actually say something constructive about.
I owned an Asus and now own a Sager.
I was quite happy with my asus, no major breakdowns, just a few annoying quirks, some of the paint from the hand rest was wearing down and became very faded not 3 months after buying it, and this became very annoying but its not essentially a make or break issue.
I tried to take to the retailer I originally bought it from, said that they could take the notebook for 3-4 weeks in order to have it repaired... I use my laptop for many things and I cant afford to not have it for that amount of time...
I havent owned my sager for that long, but I can tell you that no other machine I have ever seen feels so high quality... I heartedly recommend Sager over Asus, any day based from my experience.

[powerpack]

Oh sure just because he owned both? Are you gonna believe him?:D:)

Asus are good but Clevo's seem to have an advantage. I am about to start calling them the "ThinkPads" of the gaming world.;)

[Lost]

Haha, sounds good guys.

As of now:
leaning towards 8662,
(but fearful of the heat and loudness,
and powerpack, i did read your posts in the owner's lounge for the
8660/8662, and they were really helpful! I understand that heat and noise
is standard on a high perfomance issue. I just don't want it to be
a distraction for me in class ;))

but 2098 and asus are still in the running :-/
(only because of the 200-300 dollars less, and suppositly, quiter.)
not to sure about how much gaming i will do in college.:p

[fallenxlionheart]

you do have quite a tough choice

[Lost]

:(

oh no guys...i think i found another contender:

Sony Vaio, 16"
Intel® Core™ 2 Duo Processor P8800 (2.66GHz)
Microsoft® Windows Vista® Home Premium 64-bit
Black
4GB DDR2-SDRAM (DDR2-800, 2GBx2)
320GB SATA Hard Disk Drive [7200 rpm]
CD/DVD playback/burning
ATI Mobility Radeon™ HD4650 graphics card with 1GB vRAM-great for games and movies
16.4" widescreen with XBRITE-ECO™ LCD technology (1600x900)

What do you guys think?
Does the Sony warranty stink?
I am just trying to iron out any final doubts = s

[powerpack]

Sony? Ban button, ban button! Wake up Justin we have an intruder! Seal the perimeter decontaminate all members. We have a breach!

OK now that that is taken care of let's talk.

First I notice we might be comparing apples to oranges? In Sony's corner they have a great rep on their screens. They deserve it but if that is important I don't know about this model. I am sure it is good but have no idea if great like some in the past. Just like a limited number of notebook MFG same with screens. Lot's of branding.

So that was the positive? I don't know the cost so I really know less than I wanna know. You have made a major change in GPU class? From high end to high mid class? I like the HD4650m very much but Xotic has a 14" with it. This is a 16". The resolution is similar to my 14". While I think perfect on my 14" I think less spectacular on a 16".

That Sony could be the best buy for you but give me cost so I can consider.

I am thinking off the top of my head NP2096 or NP2098 or a force might offer what you want?

I know nothing about Sony support so can't say anything bad about them. But if I could sure it would go like this. #$#%$@#$@#$ (#$#%$@#$@#$).

You have dropped class so consider looking at similar here before you pull the trigger.

[DRY_ICE]

From what I've heard/read Sony VAIOs are higher end computers with a very high end price. It might be a decent laptop... note you ARE downgrading performance... but the quality may be alright. I love Sony, but the computers here are much better value and performance. Sooo.... go Sony if you have deep pockets and little concern over the best performance.

[Lost]

:-/, didn't mean to bring up sony to stir up the atmosphere.
I was just on the brink, trying to decide beteen asus and sager,
then decided to allow an once inch size allowance and sorta looked around, and sony popped up. I have heard numerous horror stories about their support and heat issues, but figured that i could throw this spin at you guys to spice it up :p

p.s. About a few days ago, i was set on 2098, but then had a few concerns about the reviewed below average build quality, as a college student, it might take a few rough bumps. Then again, i think it looks a looot better than the Asus, plus it offers Sager AND XoticPc
Warranties :eek::XPCS::eek::XPCS:
And if i do get the 2098, i can finally put up a somewhat detailed user review.


here is an updated spec list with price, the sony

$1269.99



Intel® Core™ 2 Duo Processor T9600 (2.80GHz)

Microsoft® Windows Vista® Home Premium 64-bit
Black
4GB DDR2-SDRAM (DDR2-800, 2GBx2)
320GB SATA Hard Disk Drive [7200 rpm]
CD/DVD playback/burning
ATI Mobility Radeon™ HD4650 graphics card with 1GB vRAM (should be ddr3?)
16.4" widescreen with XBRITE-ECO™ LCD technology (1600x900)
Quickbooks Simple Start 2009
WLAN (802.11a/b/g/n) with integrated Bluetooth® technology
Standard Capacity Battery
p.p.s.
I am stopping by a sony store in the afternoon to check it out in peron, ill keep you guys posted.

Thanks again for helping :)

[theMethod]

Lost, there are two things I know for sure about Sonys:
1. They have a good quality, may be comparable to an Asus, but not to a Sager.
2. They cost roughly 1.3 times more than they SHOULD cost! :)

The 2098 that you have chosen has an ATI HD4650. Well, I haven't really heard "cool" things about ATIs heating issues! :P (Barring an exception; I've heard that the 3870 is supposed to be a "cooler running" model!). So I'll suggest unless your ATI is a 3870, go with an NVIDIA gpu. It would produce lesser heat and believe me, just BELIEVE me on this, heating issues of a gaming laptop are REALLY a big pain later on if you don't keep that in mind while making a purchase. :)

[Anewbus]

:-/, didn't mean to bring up sony to stir up the atmosphere.
I was just on the brink, trying to decide beteen asus and sager,
then decided to allow an once inch size allowance and sorta looked around, and sony popped up. I have heard numerous horror stories about their support and heat issues, but figured that i could throw this spin at you guys to spice it up :p

p.s. About a few days ago, i was set on 2098, but then had a few concerns about the reviewed below average build quality, as a college student, it might take a few rough bumps. Then again, i think it looks a looot better than the Asus, plus it offers Sager AND XoticPc
Warranties :eek::XPCS::eek::XPCS:
And if i do get the 2098, i can finally put up a somewhat detailed user review.


here is an updated spec list with price, the sony

$1269.99




Intel® Core™ 2 Duo Processor T9600 (2.80GHz)

Microsoft® Windows Vista® Home Premium 64-bit
Black
4GB DDR2-SDRAM (DDR2-800, 2GBx2)
320GB SATA Hard Disk Drive [7200 rpm]
CD/DVD playback/burning
ATI Mobility Radeon™ HD4650 graphics card with 1GB vRAM (should be ddr3?)
16.4" widescreen with XBRITE-ECO™ LCD technology (1600x900)
Quickbooks Simple Start 2009
WLAN (802.11a/b/g/n) with integrated Bluetooth® technology
Standard Capacity Battery
p.p.s.
I am stopping by a sony store in the afternoon to check it out in peron, ill keep you guys posted.

Thanks again for helping :)

Sony, huh? Sonys are not any tougher than any other notebook.
What Proc does that thing carry?
That one you listed is not offering you much.

1)funky native resolution, but workable (ultra wide screen)

2) Quickbooks, big deal who cares because it is not the full program. It's only a sample!

3)Battery life? What is Sony standard batt life? an hour? Also in case you did not know Sony has had major problems with their batteries as in blowing up and such. Don't know if they ever really resolved it. They say they have, but.

4) If you like bloatware that cripples your system then you'll love Sony. (XoticPC does NOT do bloatware)!

5) Sony Warranty? One year "limited" warranty on parts and labor is what you get. Sure if you want to spend another $300 on an extended warranty that's fine, but it is still "limited".
Tech support? What tech support? Sony doesn't have it unless you enjoy trying to get some poor guy in India to understand anything beyond "reboot". Zero Customer service.
Compare to Xotic standard Warranty = 3 years labor/1 year parts and that's a "full" warranty, not "limited"
"Limited" means they can make any excuse not to honor the warranty and you have to swallow it.

6) You do NOT get a physical official full copy of the OS like you would with Xotic. If your even slightly lucky you'll get a "restoration" disc which is crap. If not, you won't get a disc and they will just back up the OS someplace hard to get to on the HDD itself which is no good. I'n not even sure you would get a drivers disc!

[Lost]

theMethod- i will check out what xotic has interms of nvidia.

Anewbus - :-/ the quick book thing was an mistake, forgot to delete it after the copy and paste, thanks for the info though = ) yea i agree xotic warranty is kickass, right now i am looking into how to get my labor warranty through xotic, because the 2098 offers 3 year Sager support.

How is the quality of 2098? or 2096 for that matter? better or worse than asus? from the reviews i have read, asus is a bout a 7.5/10 where as sager 2098 is 4.5/10:-/

[Anewbus]

theMethod- i will check out what xotic has interms of nvidia.

Anewbus - :-/ the quick book thing was an mistake, forgot to delete it after the copy and paste, thanks for the info though = ) yea i agree xotic warranty is kickass, right now i am looking into how to get my labor warranty through xotic, because the 2098 offers 3 year Sager support.

How is the quality of 2098? or 2096 for that matter? better or worse than asus? from the reviews i have read, asus is a bout a 7.5/10 where as sager 2098 is 4.5/10:-/

Well, if you have the notebook shipped to Xotic first and then Xotic will ship to you two good things wll happen.
1) Xotic will throughly test the unit
2) avoid nasty taxes:biggrin:

My Force is built on the Compal JHL90 and it is solid so far. I've had it for about 11 months now. I do know that Compal redesigned the JHL90 so I'm not sure how it compares. Could be worse or better than mine. You know how it is, sometimes redesigns don't go as planned and sometimes they are most welcome.
If your in the US and if you want a Sager and can get the full warranty through Xotic, I'd say your covered and can go with the Sager. Asus makes fine notebooks as well and would be a good choice for warranty outside the US.

[theMethod]

theMethod- i will check out what xotic has interms of nvidia.

The Sager NP8662 which was one of your original choices has an NVIDIA. Understatement. It has an NVIDIA GTX 260M! :)

Alternatively, you could look at Force 3551. It wasn't there in your options but I suggest you have a look, chances are you're gonna like it! :) It has NVIDIA GTS 160M which is a great performing card (better than HD4650 but less than GTX 260M) which also stays cooler than today's other high performing mobile graphics solutions and is more power efficient.

[Lost]

:phaha, thats quite serendipitous, i was just looking at the Force 3551
(oh btw, i went to the sony store, and yea very disappointing)
sorry to throw yet another one out, but
Force 3551:

FORCE 3551 (http://www.xoticpc.com/product_info.php?products_id=2596{76}2005{187}1757 {94}1074{92}2446{88}2463{194}2594{186}1532{93}2507 {193}657{112}656{98}1907{96}2461{168}1453{116}696{ 117}707{120}703{110}738{169}1449{119}1898{100}734{ 164}1441{107}1539{106}1690{121}694{108}710{109}711 {170}1492{173}1175{167}1452{103}2020{113}1413{111} 1414{69}2536)(good to hear that it is relativley cool and hopefully quiet, and that gpu is better. thanks theMethod :) )

- 15.4" WXGA "Glare Type" Super Clear Ultra Bright Glossy Screen (1280x800) - MSI
- -Intel® P8700 45nm "Montevina" Core™2 Duo 2.53GHz w/3MB L2 On-die cache - 1066MHz FSB 25 watt
- nVidia GeForce GTS 160M 1024MB PCI-Express DDR3 DX10
- - 4,096MB (2 SODIMMS) DDR3 1066MHz Dual Channel Memory
- - Combo Dual Layer SuperMulti 8X DVDRW Drive w/ Software
- - 320GB 7200RPM WD or Seagate (Serial-ATA II 3GB/s)
- Spare Smart Li-ion Battery (9-Cell)
- -Windows Vista Home Premium 64-Bit + Windows 7 Home Premium Upgrade Coupon w/ Drivers & Utilities CD's
- 1 Year Complete Care Warranty - 1 Year Parts with 2nd Day Shipping, 24/7 Telephone Tech Support & Lifetime Labor Warranty

Do you guys think these options are worth the money?

15.4" WSXGA+ "Glossy" Type Super Clear Ultra Bright Screen (1680x1050) ( + 75 )

3 Year Complete Care Warranty - 3 Year Parts with Next Day Shipping, 24/7 Telephone Tech Support & Lifetime Labor Warranty (+169)

And what is Life time labor or complete care for that matter? :-/

THANK YOU ALLLLLL SO MUCH!
I WOULD HAVE GONE CRAZY WITHOUT YOU:notworthy:notworthy:notworthy






$1,453.00

[Anewbus]

:phaha, thats quite serendipitous, i was just looking at the Force 3551
(oh btw, i went to the sony store, and yea very disappointing)
sorry to throw yet another one out, but
Force 3551:

FORCE 3551 (http://www.xoticpc.com/product_info.php?products_id=2596{76}2005{187}1757 {94}1074{92}2446{88}2463{194}2594{186}1532{93}2507 {193}657{112}656{98}1907{96}2461{168}1453{116}696{ 117}707{120}703{110}738{169}1449{119}1898{100}734{ 164}1441{107}1539{106}1690{121}694{108}710{109}711 {170}1492{173}1175{167}1452{103}2020{113}1413{111} 1414{69}2536)(good to hear that it is relativley cool and hopefully quiet, and that gpu is better. thanks theMethod :) )

- 15.4" WXGA "Glare Type" Super Clear Ultra Bright Glossy Screen (1280x800) - MSI
- -Intel® P8700 45nm "Montevina" Core™2 Duo 2.53GHz w/3MB L2 On-die cache - 1066MHz FSB 25 watt
- nVidia GeForce GTS 160M 1024MB PCI-Express DDR3 DX10
- - 4,096MB (2 SODIMMS) DDR3 1066MHz Dual Channel Memory
- - Combo Dual Layer SuperMulti 8X DVDRW Drive w/ Software
- - 320GB 7200RPM WD or Seagate (Serial-ATA II 3GB/s)
- Spare Smart Li-ion Battery (9-Cell)
- -Windows Vista Home Premium 64-Bit + Windows 7 Home Premium Upgrade Coupon w/ Drivers & Utilities CD's
- 1 Year Complete Care Warranty - 1 Year Parts with 2nd Day Shipping, 24/7 Telephone Tech Support & Lifetime Labor Warranty

Do you guys think these options are worth the money?

15.4" WSXGA+ "Glossy" Type Super Clear Ultra Bright Screen (1680x1050) ( + 75 )

3 Year Complete Care Warranty - 3 Year Parts with Next Day Shipping, 24/7 Telephone Tech Support & Lifetime Labor Warranty (+169)

And what is Life time labor or complete care for that matter? :-/

THANK YOU ALLLLLL SO MUCH!
I WOULD HAVE GONE CRAZY WITHOUT YOU:notworthy:notworthy:notworthy






$1,453.00

I believe that complete care you are asking about is only Xotic's best warranty! That's 3-years parts and LIFETIME labor with NEXT DAY shipping BOTH WAYS! Plus FREE 24/7 LIFETIME DOMESTIC Tech support. These are things the big mainstream companies do not have. (ie Sony, Dell/Alienware, HP etc.) If your desiring peace of mind (as I was with my first purchase of my Force) you could not find a warranty like this for $169 anywhere but here.:XPCS::notworthy

The screen res of 1680x1050 is worth it. It gives you more flexibility and you can adjust all the way down to 800x600 if you ever need to. (Different games have different resolution ranges they can play smoothly in. Sometimes if having everything on high is causing a tiny bit of trouble you can leave it all on high and drop the res a notch).:)

[theMethod]

The screen res of 1680x1050 is worth it.

No doubt about it. Just take it! It's worth paying another 150 bucks for: 75 is nothing! :)

[fallenxlionheart]

im a BIG sony fan..theres no doubt about that....when its there products vs someone elses i always go sony.....except when it comes to computers...they make beautiful powerful and great machines.....its just not quite the price i would be looking at....plus....sony dosent stuff an i7 in there laptops!!!!:laugh: